This only applies to donor restricted funds, which account for about 40% of Pitt's endowment. The other 60% is unrestricted and controlled by the university.
Pitt Stadium
- Thread starter the_insider_
- Start date
This only applies to donor restricted funds, which account for about 40% of Pitt's endowment. The other 60% is unrestricted and controlled by the university.
if we used the savings from the stadium
What "savings" ? We're not "saving" money by not building a stadium. You can't issue bonds or apply for state funding to hire Urban Meyer. $53 of the $93 million for the Pete was from the state, directly or indirectly. The Petersens gave $10 million, an enormous gift, but worth basically one years salary for Urban Meyer.
What "savings" ? We're not "saving" money by not building a stadium. You can't issue bonds or apply for state funding to hire Urban Meyer. $53 of the $93 million for the Pete was from the state, directly or indirectly. The Petersens gave $10 million, an enormous gift, but worth basically one years salary for Urban Meyer.
No, because I don’t think Ohio State was successful because of Urban Meyer any more than they are still successful under Ryan Day or were successful before Meyer with John Cooper, Jim Tressell, Earl Bruce and Woody Hayes.
I just don’t buy the coach as magic ticket theory where you hire the right coach and voila, suddenly you start winning all the games. I think that’s mostly horseshit.
that's why I added the caveat "do the things winning programs do". Like having a lawyer on 24 hour call to get players out of trouble . Or not firing your ace defensive coach even though you know he is a pedophile. Or not accepting a player like Travon Chapmon (?) to your recruiting class even though he committed. It's not about the magic ticket, it is about the commitment to winning at all costs.
So if the commitment to winning was there, do you think the stadium would be an issue?
We just don’t have anywhere near the infrastructure that a school like Ohio State has. We can’t do the little things because we don’t have the big things.
Trust me as someone who has spent a lot of time at both places, they’re just not at all comparable.
Heinz Field is FAR nicer than Ohio Stadium — its not even close. However, if it were located 4 miles from the tOSU campus, there’s no way in hell they would leave the Horseshoe for Heinz Field. They wouldn’t even consider it.
Trust me as someone who has spent a lot of time at both places, they’re just not at all comparable.
Heinz Field is FAR nicer than Ohio Stadium — its not even close. However, if it were located 4 miles from the tOSU campus, there’s no way in hell they would leave the Horseshoe for Heinz Field. They wouldn’t even consider it.
Last edited:
That's actually not true about the Falk Library in Scaife. The HSLS supports both Pitt and UPMC: see https://www.hsls.pitt.edu/residents-fellows
The Departments of Biology and Departments of Neuroscience have a LOT of interaction with the researchers in the med school. I have worked in research in both the Med School in Scaife and Dietrich's Dept of Neuroscience. There is a lot of work with Swanson because of Swanson's bioengineering. UPMC does significant work CMU too, largely on developing software and information platforms, but it pales greatly compared to what it does with Pitt.
I'm not referring to the McGowan Center, which was a joint program of Pitt and UPMC established in 2001 (when UPMC was only in its third year of independence from the university). McGowan grew out of Pitt's McGowan Center for Artificial Organ Development. I was referring to Pitt's Innovation Institute that wasn't established until 2013, which consolidated multiple other intellectual and incubator enterprises that had existed within the university (such as the office of technology management). The Innovation Institute doesn't have anything directly to do with UPMC. See: https://issuu.com/upitt/docs/innovation-2018-year-in-review
I have no idea what point you are trying to make about UPMC's clinical employment financials but $200m in university support is way beyond any other academic medical center's support of their university and it is a substantial amount of supplementation of the health sciences budget. My point was when UPMC does well, it is great for Pitt.
Yes, UPMC is very business savvy and functions independently in many of their endeavors, particularly outside of the region...that is of course, with the university still appointing a third of UPMC's board. UPMC is definitely innovative, particularly in operations and delivery, but many innovations, particularly clinical, flow from the University, which is why UPMC pumps $200 million a year into it, not to mention support of the university is codified in UPMC's articles of incorporation. Seriously, if you think the University doesn't innovate without UPMC, or vice versa, I don't know what to tell you. It really isn't important either, since the two are complementary and symbiotic.
Last edited:
Well really it was not Pitt that built up the medical center. That was driven internally and financially by UPMC. Pitt had little to do with that financially other than the 3 men who conceived the idea worked out of Western Psych and got the opportunity to in essence take over Presby when they helped discover an embezzlement scheme.
As you note, UPMC supports the university's health sciences to the tune of $200 million annually, not vice versa. UPMC in all practicality drives both the clinical and research operations. The research funds may be housed at Pitt but they are more along for the ride than driving the boat. Not saying that is a bad thing - it is a symbiotic relationship, and the University does its part, but the financial aspect and main decision making is controlled by the UPMC side
Last edited:
Would you prefer your health system operate in the red, live hand to mouth, not be able to attract and afford the best and brightest talent? Not me.
As much as people who live in Pittsburgh enjoy it, the numbers strongly suggest that others do not feel that way.
I don't like UPMCs leadership, but I sure as hell respect it. Why? Because UPMC is our demon and even though it is as tough as nails, it is still local and thus subject to local influence. You want it run out of Houston, Cleveland, Philly? Not I.
Highmark has marched legions of executive vps down the charity gala aisle for decades. Each EVP tasked with telling the other EVPs just how smart they were. Highmark was fat and lazy for 20 years...and then UPMC came in hard and tight with fastballs!
Then HIGHMARK realized it had a legion of highly educated, unproductive EVPs and they got their undies in a bunch!
Too bad.
Pitt and UPMC are 2 of the 3 reasons Pittsburgh is relevant. CMU is the other.
That's a blast from the past, forgot about that one.
Little things tell you a lot about an organization.
A University that can't figure out how or where to build a track, and tennis courts on campus doesn't have a good infrastructure plan.
Even if a University that doesn't have a tennis team has tennis courts since they're good things to have for the students and the community.
Many Universities generate revenues from their on campus tennis complex's, they bubble them for all year round use and offer memberships to the community and University employees.
A track is a nice goodwill thing to offer the surrounding residents and students.
Most " land locked " colleges and Universities have both.
A University that can't figure out how or where to build a track, and tennis courts on campus doesn't have a good infrastructure plan.
Even if a University that doesn't have a tennis team has tennis courts since they're good things to have for the students and the community.
Many Universities generate revenues from their on campus tennis complex's, they bubble them for all year round use and offer memberships to the community and University employees.
A track is a nice goodwill thing to offer the surrounding residents and students.
Most " land locked " colleges and Universities have both.
Last edited:
Cold, sterile, no atmosphere, tailgating being phased out, not our stadium. seat backs are nice, food still awful & overpriced. We sold our FB soul in 1998.
(Please excuse the hyperbole!!! I'm a traditionalist.)
it wasn't cold & sterile against Penn State, Notre Dame, Cinci. Sparse attendance makes stadiums cold & sterile.
The nicest of the new stadiums IMO is Baylor's McLane Stadium. Cost $266 million in 2012.
Of course, Baylor had the land and a sugar daddy. But it is a beautiful CFB stadium and would be about the right size for Pitt.
https://www.wacotrib.com/sports/col...cle_d9e6a3c6-1f87-5fc9-8c1b-99ae1a8c8bf5.html
Of course, Baylor had the land and a sugar daddy. But it is a beautiful CFB stadium and would be about the right size for Pitt.
https://www.wacotrib.com/sports/col...cle_d9e6a3c6-1f87-5fc9-8c1b-99ae1a8c8bf5.html
UPMC is entirely a university spin-off entity. It really originated from the university's efforts to create an academic medical center which began when Pitt's medical school built Falk Clinic and enticed Presby, Children's, Eye & Ear, Magee, and Womens hopitals to move on campus to form the University Medical Center in the 1930s. It added pieces to this ever tightening integration like Western Psych and Salk to became the University of Pittsburgh Health Center in the 50s, and then incorporated into UHCP in the 60s, followed by a consolidation into what was termed the Medical and Health Care Division (MHCD) of the University in the 80s. And yes, Presby University Hospital was part of this but still operated independently. By this time the University of Pittsburgh Physicians (UPP) was the component of the university that served as the clinical practice plan for all University faculty which had clinical service appointments on top of the academic and research duties that were performed under various other University departments or centers. After Montefiore was added in 1990, the MHCD was renamed to the "University of Pittsburgh Medical Center," a name an acronym whose copyright, by the way, is still owned by the University. UPMC wasn't spun off as a legally independent entity from the University for another eight years, at which time UPP was also transferred to UPMC so the University could divest of its faculty's clinical operations. However, the University retained all operations on the academic and research side. To this day though, health science faculty are employed and overseen by the University for all academic and research endeavors, but their clinical appointment and compensation for clinical responsibilities is handled by UPP, which is now entirely under UPMC. There are arrangements between Pitt and UPMC for a common paymaster for these individuals for employee tax calculation purposes. In any case, the spin-off of UPMC in 1998 was done to shield the University from financial risks involved in being a clinical provider and to allow the Medical Center to be more aggressive in its early battles with AHREF and Highmark (it had already formed Tri-State as a confederation of hospitals like Passavant and Shadyside as a foil against Highmark's monopoly; those obviously later integrated to form the beginnings of the wider health system) which included considerable risks including starting its own health insurance company.
All actual bio and health science research, from the very beginning, has been entirely financed through, managed, and originated from within the University. It is university academic faculty, departments, and centers that are entirely responsible for originating the ideas and breakthroughs that get published and bring in research funding. Without that academic component, none of the top clinicians at UPMC's flagship facilities would have been there. Top medical experts, like Salk, Stazl, Jose-Alain Sahel, and Patrick Moore, aren't landing somewhere where they don't have academic appointments or are able to continue their research in a meaningful way with a robust collegial setting with the appropriate infrastructure and administrative support. Most physicians at major academic medical centers are involved in at least some research and training. That is the prestige that you mentioned before, and that mostly the University, because prestige within academic circles emanates almost entirely from research endeavors which is 100% under the University, conducted by University faculty and staff, and it always has been. And as a corollary, the medical tourism and exportation of the UPMC brand is largely based on that prestige. Otherwise, UPMC is just another Kaiser Permanente or LifePoint in the business of just getting bigger, and not trying to compete with Partners, Mayo, MD Anderson, Hopkins, and Cleveland. Go to NIH RePORT and compare how much federal bioscience research funding has ever been, and is currently awarded to, UPMC vs Pitt. But prestige that UPMC brings, and it does because it is the seat of the clinical aspect, and the prestige that the University brings for research, is symbiotic.
And as I noted, since its spinoff from the University, UPMC's articles of incorporation specifically names two, and only two, entities that is its mission to support: the University and Presby, and that is contractual to the University as well. That comes into a tune of ~$200m a year for the University based on UPMC financial performance, which is about 1/3 of what the University obtains externally from its research bioscience endeavors, and that is decidedly not just being "along for the ride," either in historical or contemporary reality. UPMC has financially supported and partnered with Pitt on many research projects since it has spun off, because it is in both entities interests to do so, they are historically and contractually tied together including co-employment of their top clinical and medical science talent, and it is actually UPMC's founding mission to do so. In these areas, the University and UPMC are of one mind.
Last edited:
And for Steeler games as well. Definitely isn't cold and sterile then.
um, parking, access, better seating, more things to do around the stadium, local restaurants
The nicest of the new stadiums IMO is Baylor's McLane Stadium. Cost $266 million in 2012.
Of course, Baylor had the land and a sugar daddy. But it is a beautiful CFB stadium and would be about the right size for Pitt.
https://www.wacotrib.com/sports/col...cle_d9e6a3c6-1f87-5fc9-8c1b-99ae1a8c8bf5.html
Sorry. Please stay with the narrative that the only comparable option is the U of M's $500 million stadium.
Are there really more things to do pre and post game than in Oakland? I'm not so sure.
Pitt Stadium was an awesome stadium full of Pitt tradition. When Pitt Stadium was built in the 1920's track was a big national sport and for years later. That's probably the reason the track was around the football field. The stands had great angles to watch a football game. He was kind of neat to go up outside by the scoreboard and look down into the stadium. Like one poster stated it was an inept administration at Pitt that let the stadium go and football program down over all these years. When Pitt was winning big with Dorsett then Marino Pitt should have reinvested in the football stadium and program at that time. They did not and it all suffered.
Honestly my main complaint about Heinz Field is it's sort of generic, boring, and ugly. Location is what it is, we'll be there for a long time. I just wish it was as nice as PNC Park or the Pete instead of being a big, open generic football stadium. It really lets a lot of the air out too in terms of crowd noise.
The great angles of being so far from the field even in the best seats ?
Yet I'd venture to say a majority would take a dumpy Pitt Stadium on campus over Heinz. What's that tell you about Heinz?
We moved from an on campus college dump, to an off campus spruced up NFL dump.
Where's the casino in Oakland? How about stage AE? All the parking lots for tailgating? How about numerous (including upscale) restaurants? Is Oakland right on the river? Awesome freeway access too
Nowhere near a majority among season ticket holders.
You'd be hard pressed to find many who were season tickets holders at both Pitt Stadium and Heinz that would choose Pitt Stadium.
Nobody sane, anyways.
Pitt Stadium was historical for sure, but c'mon it was a dump. Bottle necks trying to get in, not enough food stands, small bathrooms and bench seating. We're very happy at Heinz.
I’d go back to Pitt stadium in a heartbeat. The players and students would too, and it’s their team. They don’t care about bathrooms or club seating.
well it’s been 20 years since Pitt Stadium. I think we would have made improvements if we still had it, so “old Pitt stadium” isn’t really a valid comparison.
I know, I’m just trying to smoke out people that will say they’d rather stay at Heinz than have a brand new on campus stadium.
I mean my rankings are:
1. Fictional refurbished Pitt stadium with more modern amenities
2. Fictional, "right sized" modern bowl style football stadium on the north shore or some other off campus location
3. In reality Heinz
4. In reality Pitt stadium by its end
But fictional stadiums exist even less than demolished ones.
1. Fictional refurbished Pitt stadium with more modern amenities
2. Fictional, "right sized" modern bowl style football stadium on the north shore or some other off campus location
3. In reality Heinz
4. In reality Pitt stadium by its end
But fictional stadiums exist even less than demolished ones.
Oh. I understand now. You're one of those guys who thinks that Oakland is a run down area with no good places to eat. Carry on then.
people have all that stuff and they still don’t go to watch Pitt on the north side. It’s not moving the needle for attendance.
