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Surprised there isn’t more Ford talk

I don't get this one at all!
So we get a 5 star player who was a star in HS, played a lot of positions in HS, was all over the field in the Under Amour game ( per another poster), and PITT can't find a spot for a HS 5 star player on a 7-6 team???

Who believes this?
Better yet how can this be possible?
We have high 2 star and low 3 star on the field struggling to keep up with other programs 4 and 5 star players and we have a 5 star guy doing nothing.

He should be doing something! Anything! Special teams! Can be run the ball, return kicks that's not hard catch the freakin ball and run??????????????????????????? Or maybe design an offensive play ( maybe wildcat) for him like here's the ball run your a-s off. Anyone can understand that!

How did he get through HS football at a high level, how did he get rated a 5 star, how did he star in the Under Armour game, how did PITT f this up as we find a 5 star sitting on the bench.

If Ford had comprehension issues in HS this would have been a well know issue. HS coaches talk about this stuff with college recruiters.

Common sense says something doesn't add up.
 
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I don't get this one at all!
So we get a 5 star player who was a star in HS, played a lot of positions in HS, and PITT can't find a spot for a HS 5 star player on a 7-6 team???

Who believes this?

How did he get through HS football at a high level, how did he get rated a 5 star, how did PITT f this up as we find a 5 star sitting on the bench.

If Ford had comprehension issues in HS this would have been a well know issue. HS coaches talk about this stuff with college recruiters.

Common sense says something doesn't add up.

Happens more than you think. The kid did play at the AA level where he was by far the best athlete on the field. At the collegiate level you cant simply rely on being a great athlete as they all are pretty darn good. Also the kid likely never learned the game at the collegiate level. Its ab it more complicated than running to the ball. If he has not developed a work ethic and is not a student of the game........it may take a bit for him to adjust.
 
I don't get this one at all!
So we get a 5 star player who was a star in HS, played a lot of positions in HS, and PITT can't find a spot for a HS 5 star player on a 7-6 team???

Who believes this?

How did he get through HS football at a high level, how did he get rated a 5 star, how did he star in the Under Armour game, how did PITT f this up as we find a 5 star sitting on the bench.

If Ford had comprehension issues in HS this would have been a well know issue. HS coaches talk about this stuff with college recruiters.

Common sense says something doesn't add up.

Maybe Duzz is still upset that he couldn't get Sanders as part of a package deal with Ford.
 
Senior year; last year who cares. The point is he underperformed until his last game, against PSU I believe, when he knew the NFL scouts would be watching. He was the ultimate "Hooray for me and to hell with you" player.

He was very well known way before that, you don’t draft a guy #3 overall based on one game.

Well, they don’t at any position other than QB, with Jamarcus Russell being a prime example.
 
Again, he is only a RS frosh.
Comes from small rural school.
Probably played 1 team in his 4 years of HS that had another D1 talent.
He needs time to develop.
Just because he is a 4 star docent put him on the field automatically.
If he "trusts the process" he will be a success.
 
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I was going to reiterate the same thing. If in two years we’re having a similar discussion on why he’s not seeing the field then we will know he was evaluated incorrectly.
 
Just thinking about the guy Jurcovic (sorry if misspelled, Im not Albanian) from pine-riceland, and JT Daniels a Frosh (Starter) at USC.

Against Jurcovics toughest comp (St joe Prep). They put him to run the ball, and like a beast, he was way more talented then the defenders.
But at ND- there are already guys there- and they don't need him to run they need him to pass
So he has to develop

JT daniels stepped into a situation at USC where there was not as much of a qb contest.
And he came from sunny cali, powerhouse Mater Dei, with 5 star recivers, he was little more game ready for the season. Even though he had shit season
 
Just thinking about the guy Jurcovic (sorry if misspelled, Im not Albanian) from pine-riceland, and JT Daniels a Frosh (Starter) at USC.

Against Jurcovics toughest comp (St joe Prep). They put him to run the ball, and like a beast, he was way more talented then the defenders.
But at ND- there are already guys there- and they don't need him to run they need him to pass
So he has to develop

JT daniels stepped into a situation at USC where there was not as much of a qb contest.
And he came from sunny cali, powerhouse Mater Dei, with 5 star recivers, he was little more game ready for the season. Even though he had shit season

Just going by his age, Daniels is still a senior in high school. He graduated from MD after his junior year in June of 2018, so even though he had an up and down freshman season at USC what he accomplished is still impressive. Daniels wasn't a generational talent. He was a quality Division 1 QB something the WPIAL leaves me wanting.

By way of background, Mater Dei plays in Division I and the level of play in Division I of the Southern Section of CIF is far, far superior to PA 6A football. These are the 18 best programs in Southern California and you can get shamefully relegated every two years if you're not competitive enough. It's also Disneyland (or ground zero) for college recruiters. It's the SEC of HS football. Some private school teams in D-1 have 30 coaches - I'm not making that up - between freshman, JV and varsity staffs and the kids are coming out ready for college football. The parochial schools have amazing facilities, budgets disclosed by some to be between $500k-$750k funded by $3,500+ participation fees to help cover the stipends, travel costs, stadium rental, and new uniforms and gear that's ordered annually. Fundraising ideas brought forth by boosters aren't even approved by head coaches unless they can net 5 figures - otherwise it's not an effective use of time. The kids are bigger, stronger, faster, better coached and better prepared. Best of all there are so many under-recruited kids that all you have to do is invest time there and you'll find P5 players. These are the P5 caliber kids who wanted to go to USC or UCLA but by virtue of scholarship limits they ran into a numbers problem at their first choice and want a home.

There are over 700 high schools serving over 25 million people in Southern California (between the Southern Section and the LA City and San Diego sections) and, what, three 1A programs (USC, UCLA and SDSU)? You do the math. Pitt has the opposite problem - there are too many P5 schools too close to Pittsburgh competing for too few P5 ready WPIAL players and the school has not made enough inroads to recruiting hot beds to compensate. Have you ever noticed how "generational" WPIAL talents you people on this board become enamored with who never fully materialize at Pitt? Think Dorin Dickerson, Jordan Whitehead and now Paris Ford. These are kids who dominated at lower levels and end up as jacks of all trades at the P5 level. Sure Dickerson and Whitehead played in the NFL but the role we thought they would flourish in for four years never materialized. (i.e Dickerson as a WR/RB and Whitehead as a RB/CB.) About six years or so ago (on this board I believe) I was ridiculed for dismissing a WPIAL recruit named Rushel Shell as very average compared to starting Division I RB's in Southern California. I'm piling on a bit here but the WPIAL superstars that you think are P5 ready are not the same caliber kids who are definitely P5 ready coming out of Division 1.

Obviously, USC, UCLA and SDSU can only sign so many, ergo, naturally, Washington, Oregon, Colorado and the other Pac-12 schools move in and guess what? There take their cut and there's still high quality kids available. So the XII moves in and there's still kids left over. Then crickets. This explains why junior college football is so good in California. These are kids who can and should play in the B1G, ACC or American but by virtue of not having those schools invest in recruiting there they end up at a JC rather than lowering themselves to play at 1-AA or D-II or D-III because they know they can play at the 1-A level. Heck Ricky Town isn't very good but he's way better than anyone that came out of the WPIAL that year.

OK, now back to Ford and how he relates to my point. Ford through no fault of his own was overrated and simply ill-prepared mentally and physically for P5 college football in 2017 and we've learned he wasn't ready in 2018 either. Can he improve? Sure. Hopefully he will. Hopefully in time for 2019. The lesson is just because a recruiting service says a WPIAL kid is a five-star prospect that means nothing to me and you too should take it with a grain of salt. There are better kids, and more of them, playing in better classifications, just a 1, 2, 3 or 4 hour flight away.

The California kids have always been just too far away for the Junko Gang I guess. But there's still time. Tell Tim Salem and Shawn Watson and Pat Narduzzi and Andre Powell when you see them at a bar to eschew Junko's decades old philosophy that recruiting dollars are best spent locally. Tell them to up their game. Tell them to spend the money where the abundance of high quality players are. Gents, it's time to go fishing exclusively in Florida, Texas, California, Louisiana and Georgia. Then maybe Ohio and Jersey. Then maybe North Carolina and Virginia.
 
He's never going to play CB here. That's clear as day as he's way behind his lesser-recruited classmates. Probably won't make the 2 deep at CB next year either. I have my doubts if they will ever trust him at Safety. He certainly wouldn't see the field much if at all at S next year. I think he probably won't start until his 5th year and just be ordinary back there. Just terribly overrated

Wow. Those are some bold statements.and harsh words.

You say he won’t play CB or S. I wouldn’t be so sure. He is an unbelievable athlete who according to Narduzzi was all over the field making plays and getting INTs at camp before the season started. Maybe he isn’t suited for CB, but I can’t imagine PN not giving him more playing time at S next year or moving him to LB if he puts some weight on... or even use him on offense... they need help.

He is an incredible athlete that should be on the field somewhere... becasue he’s proven he is that good- he just hasn’t had enough tome on the field to show it yet.

I believe Paris Fors will be a beast soon.

Some fans were beating up on Hamlin..calling him overrated too. He is now playing quite well.

Let’s have some patience... and a little faith.
 
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I posted about Ford last summer, and was immediately branded a Nitter, again, for my opinion. It was not what everybody wanted to hear.

First off, his entire recruiting cycle was odd. He washed out of Central after his freshman year, and had a very strong sophomore year at Seton La-Salle. Many of his offers came quite early, but his recruiting never really picked up steam like it should have. After he ended up at Steel Valley, many of these schools stopped paying much attention to him. Everybody assumed this was because of his well-documented academic deficiencies.

He only made one OV, which was to Pitt. It was noted recently that Miami was recruiting him hard and he stayed loyal. Well, Miami never actually offered him. PSU, ND, OSU etc all slow-played him significantly. Again, it could have been his academic issues, or not.

At any rate, his odd non-recruitment combined with his complete lack of production has been a mystery, but apparently there are a lot of recruiters out there that probably aren't that surprised.
 
Just going by his age, Daniels is still a senior in high school. He graduated from MD after his junior year in June of 2018, so even though he had an up and down freshman season at USC what he accomplished is still impressive. Daniels wasn't a generational talent. He was a quality Division 1 QB something the WPIAL leaves me wanting.

By way of background, Mater Dei plays in Division I and the level of play in Division I of the Southern Section of CIF is far, far superior to PA 6A football. These are the 18 best programs in Southern California and you can get shamefully relegated every two years if you're not competitive enough. It's also Disneyland (or ground zero) for college recruiters. It's the SEC of HS football. Some private school teams in D-1 have 30 coaches - I'm not making that up - between freshman, JV and varsity staffs and the kids are coming out ready for college football. The parochial schools have amazing facilities, budgets disclosed by some to be between $500k-$750k funded by $3,500+ participation fees to help cover the stipends, travel costs, stadium rental, and new uniforms and gear that's ordered annually. Fundraising ideas brought forth by boosters aren't even approved by head coaches unless they can net 5 figures - otherwise it's not an effective use of time. The kids are bigger, stronger, faster, better coached and better prepared. Best of all there are so many under-recruited kids that all you have to do is invest time there and you'll find P5 players. These are the P5 caliber kids who wanted to go to USC or UCLA but by virtue of scholarship limits they ran into a numbers problem at their first choice and want a home.

There are over 700 high schools serving over 25 million people in Southern California (between the Southern Section and the LA City and San Diego sections) and, what, three 1A programs (USC, UCLA and SDSU)? You do the math. Pitt has the opposite problem - there are too many P5 schools too close to Pittsburgh competing for too few P5 ready WPIAL players and the school has not made enough inroads to recruiting hot beds to compensate. Have you ever noticed how "generational" WPIAL talents you people on this board become enamored with who never fully materialize at Pitt? Think Dorin Dickerson, Jordan Whitehead and now Paris Ford. These are kids who dominated at lower levels and end up as jacks of all trades at the P5 level. Sure Dickerson and Whitehead played in the NFL but the role we thought they would flourish in for four years never materialized. (i.e Dickerson as a WR/RB and Whitehead as a RB/CB.) About six years or so ago (on this board I believe) I was ridiculed for dismissing a WPIAL recruit named Rushel Shell as very average compared to starting Division I RB's in Southern California. I'm piling on a bit here but the WPIAL superstars that you think are P5 ready are not the same caliber kids who are definitely P5 ready coming out of Division 1.

Obviously, USC, UCLA and SDSU can only sign so many, ergo, naturally, Washington, Oregon, Colorado and the other Pac-12 schools move in and guess what? There take their cut and there's still high quality kids available. So the XII moves in and there's still kids left over. Then crickets. This explains why junior college football is so good in California. These are kids who can and should play in the B1G, ACC or American but by virtue of not having those schools invest in recruiting there they end up at a JC rather than lowering themselves to play at 1-AA or D-II or D-III because they know they can play at the 1-A level. Heck Ricky Town isn't very good but he's way better than anyone that came out of the WPIAL that year.

OK, now back to Ford and how he relates to my point. Ford through no fault of his own was overrated and simply ill-prepared mentally and physically for P5 college football in 2017 and we've learned he wasn't ready in 2018 either. Can he improve? Sure. Hopefully he will. Hopefully in time for 2019. The lesson is just because a recruiting service says a WPIAL kid is a five-star prospect that means nothing to me and you too should take it with a grain of salt. There are better kids, and more of them, playing in better classifications, just a 1, 2, 3 or 4 hour flight away.

The California kids have always been just too far away for the Junko Gang I guess. But there's still time. Tell Tim Salem and Shawn Watson and Pat Narduzzi and Andre Powell when you see them at a bar to eschew Junko's decades old philosophy that recruiting dollars are best spent locally. Tell them to up their game. Tell them to spend the money where the abundance of high quality players are. Gents, it's time to go fishing exclusively in Florida, Texas, California, Louisiana and Georgia. Then maybe Ohio and Jersey. Then maybe North Carolina and Virginia.

There's a lot going on here and much of it doesn't make sense.

1. The best HS football in the world is in So-Cal but the So-Cal college teams aren't winning anything and the Pac 12 is generally regarded as the weakest P5 conference most years. You might want to let the Pacific NW Pac12 schools that have been the primary force in the conference in recent years know they're way off base by taking so many kids from the Pacific NW.
2. You cherry-picked a few WPIAL players that were "generational" who were good college players and found their way to the NFL, and then immediately dismissed them as being "not the same caliber" as So-Cal HS players.
3. Jordan Whitehead was recruited as a CB and is playing CB in Tampa. How Pitt used him doesn't make him any less of a player. One of the greatest players to ever play the game played TE at Pitt and you can't really say Pitt is a place that TE's want to land right now because of how the staff uses them.
4. It's weird that some Pac 12 schools, UCLA included, offered a kid like Ford when he was only a WPIAL player and not of the vaunted "Division I" lineage.
5. Rushel Shell wasn't "very average". He had off the field problems that prevented him from realizing his potential. You picked him to buoy your point but that didn't make you right.

We know Pitt isn't great at recruiting and that the WPIAL isn't as populous as SoCal these days. That's about all you got right here.
 
This reminds me of the post complaining about Morrissey starting at Center as a walk on, Hall and Ollie being bums, Maddox being horrible, etc etc etc..........

Just keeping it real about Maddox (even he would probably admit it), he got ALOT better his senior year. Oh, he could usually stick with receivers pretty well his sophomore and junior year, but he didn’t turn and use his hands well until his final year... which made all of the difference.
 
Just going by his age, Daniels is still a senior in high school. He graduated from MD after his junior year in June of 2018, so even though he had an up and down freshman season at USC what he accomplished is still impressive. Daniels wasn't a generational talent. He was a quality Division 1 QB something the WPIAL leaves me wanting.

By way of background, Mater Dei plays in Division I and the level of play in Division I of the Southern Section of CIF is far, far superior to PA 6A football. These are the 18 best programs in Southern California and you can get shamefully relegated every two years if you're not competitive enough. It's also Disneyland (or ground zero) for college recruiters. It's the SEC of HS football. Some private school teams in D-1 have 30 coaches - I'm not making that up - between freshman, JV and varsity staffs and the kids are coming out ready for college football. The parochial schools have amazing facilities, budgets disclosed by some to be between $500k-$750k funded by $3,500+ participation fees to help cover the stipends, travel costs, stadium rental, and new uniforms and gear that's ordered annually. Fundraising ideas brought forth by boosters aren't even approved by head coaches unless they can net 5 figures - otherwise it's not an effective use of time. The kids are bigger, stronger, faster, better coached and better prepared. Best of all there are so many under-recruited kids that all you have to do is invest time there and you'll find P5 players. These are the P5 caliber kids who wanted to go to USC or UCLA but by virtue of scholarship limits they ran into a numbers problem at their first choice and want a home.

There are over 700 high schools serving over 25 million people in Southern California (between the Southern Section and the LA City and San Diego sections) and, what, three 1A programs (USC, UCLA and SDSU)? You do the math. Pitt has the opposite problem - there are too many P5 schools too close to Pittsburgh competing for too few P5 ready WPIAL players and the school has not made enough inroads to recruiting hot beds to compensate. Have you ever noticed how "generational" WPIAL talents you people on this board become enamored with who never fully materialize at Pitt? Think Dorin Dickerson, Jordan Whitehead and now Paris Ford. These are kids who dominated at lower levels and end up as jacks of all trades at the P5 level. Sure Dickerson and Whitehead played in the NFL but the role we thought they would flourish in for four years never materialized. (i.e Dickerson as a WR/RB and Whitehead as a RB/CB.) About six years or so ago (on this board I believe) I was ridiculed for dismissing a WPIAL recruit named Rushel Shell as very average compared to starting Division I RB's in Southern California. I'm piling on a bit here but the WPIAL superstars that you think are P5 ready are not the same caliber kids who are definitely P5 ready coming out of Division 1.

Obviously, USC, UCLA and SDSU can only sign so many, ergo, naturally, Washington, Oregon, Colorado and the other Pac-12 schools move in and guess what? There take their cut and there's still high quality kids available. So the XII moves in and there's still kids left over. Then crickets. This explains why junior college football is so good in California. These are kids who can and should play in the B1G, ACC or American but by virtue of not having those schools invest in recruiting there they end up at a JC rather than lowering themselves to play at 1-AA or D-II or D-III because they know they can play at the 1-A level. Heck Ricky Town isn't very good but he's way better than anyone that came out of the WPIAL that year.

OK, now back to Ford and how he relates to my point. Ford through no fault of his own was overrated and simply ill-prepared mentally and physically for P5 college football in 2017 and we've learned he wasn't ready in 2018 either. Can he improve? Sure. Hopefully he will. Hopefully in time for 2019. The lesson is just because a recruiting service says a WPIAL kid is a five-star prospect that means nothing to me and you too should take it with a grain of salt. There are better kids, and more of them, playing in better classifications, just a 1, 2, 3 or 4 hour flight away.

The California kids have always been just too far away for the Junko Gang I guess. But there's still time. Tell Tim Salem and Shawn Watson and Pat Narduzzi and Andre Powell when you see them at a bar to eschew Junko's decades old philosophy that recruiting dollars are best spent locally. Tell them to up their game. Tell them to spend the money where the abundance of high quality players are. Gents, it's time to go fishing exclusively in Florida, Texas, California, Louisiana and Georgia. Then maybe Ohio and Jersey. Then maybe North Carolina and Virginia.

Agree with a lot that you said.

Problem is, Cali is a long way away for an 18 year old.

When pitt hoops was at its best, we got guys from NYC, Jersey, Maryland/DC, Ahioa, and Local (and there is definitely no local hoop talent)

That is pitt territory.
Kids form OH, MI, ILL will always go big 10
Kids from down south, Tx, and Cali don't even know that Pitt exists.

Obviously would want guys from cali, but be realistic.

There are a lot of good players in the NE region, And we have to get those players. And the guys we get (Ford) has to be developed.
 
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