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Vader Recruiting: Capel closing in on Elite Star Talent

Few would disagree with what you say here given the current roster makeup for next season. The only way it even becomes possible that Brown goes voluntarily or otherwise (and some other player could go instead) is if two possible but unlikely things were to both occur:

(1) Two or more 2020 recruits (reclassified from 2021?) are added this spring.

AND

(2) One of the two is a consensus 5-star top 50 Center recruit.

I get it that a good amount of people would disagree with me given how much this board hates Brown but I'm just voicing my opinion.

I agree with the reclassifications though and if Sonogo or Kepnang came here, he'd probably grad transfer out if he had his classes in order.
 
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Seniors:
Kene
Hamilton

1 open scholarship

2020 Class:

Max
Hughley
Collier

Basically the class is full from a numbers standpoint for next year. However, there's a path to one more. George moving on. That gives us 4 potential scholarships for 2020 class. I'm assuming that's already in the works. I'm sure Capel is helping George find a school he can move to as a grad transfer.

Other than that, I don't see where a 5th one could open up. No chance Terrell Brown moves on - by that I mean the coaches will want him to stay if they plan on winning in 2020-21. He's a huge difference maker defensively. He'll be the top shot blocker in Pitt history when he's done. You don't push that kid out the door.

Maybe AKC moves on? I don't want to say he was a desperate take by Capel last year, but I kind of think he was. I'm sure he'll be serviceable as an upper class man, but the two kids coming in next year may very well pass him up.

We'll see what happens - I'd be utterly shocked if Brown moves on. It wouldn't make any sense.
 
Kene is gone. Wouldn't the program have to apply for the RS? If they need the ship, he is gone. I can see AC and GD being recruited over already. XJ, TM, AT, and JC all showed/are showing flashes as freshman. AT clearly has improved (I too posted before he may be recruited over, however, have been happy to eat my words and see his improvement over the course of this year). As such, I think its the other two recruits who came in this year may benefit by transferring down a level. It is about winning now, and when Capel hits on recruits, it is clearly evident. This is without really pulling in any top 100 guys yet on the court. TB can be hit or miss in a game and when on, he is a valuable 5-10 mins and 5 fouls. Next year, they will have additional depth to play with. I'd love for TB to make the tourney after being on that 0-19 team and getting a senior day ovation from the loyal base.

I gotta disagree with your statement that it is about winning now. To us fans, sure it's all about winning now but it's clear to Capel that this rebuild is going to take more time especially to gain steam on the recruiting trail. Capel's brick by brick motto signifies this however the addition of certain players, or bricks per se, will obviously accelerate this. Capel's a lot more patient than us and that as a leader is an incredibly important trait to have.
 
I don't want Brown gone, but who goes if Jeffress wants to come to Pitt and reclass into 2020? Who goes if Sanoga wants to reclass into 2020 and come to Pitt? At the end of the day Pitt will still be a bubble team next year for the NCAA with or without Brown and the upside of these other players is hard to ignore especially when the long-term viability of the program is more critical.

If Jeffress comes in 2020 then George goes.
If Sanoga comes in 2020 then Drumgoole or Coulibaly goes

Brown is more valuable next year than those guys.
 
If Jeffress comes in 2020 then George goes.
If Sanoga comes in 2020 then Drumgoole or Coulibaly goes

Brown is more valuable next year than those guys.

I think Brown goes -- I think Coulbaly and Drumgoole are more important long-term. Capel isn't interested in making decision that leads to winning for just one year.
 
Isn’t Coulibaly part of the equation to try and help get Sanogo here? Coulibaly leaving certainly would not help trying to land Sanago.

They are both from Mali and are supposed to be friends. Fans should be careful to not throw anyone under the bus who doesn't contribute significantly immediately as a true freshman.

In any event, it would be an ideal outcome if Jeffress would arrive in the 2020 class and Sanogo in the 2021 class so that only George would need to graduate and grad transfer this summer.
 
They are both from Mali and are supposed to be friends. Fans should be careful to not throw anyone under the bus who doesn't contribute significantly immediately as a true freshman.

In any event, it would be an ideal outcome if Jeffress would arrive in the 2020 class and Sanogo in the 2021 class so that only George would need to graduate and grad transfer this summer.

They were both on the U19 team. Coulibaly averaged 13.1. Sanogo didn't play much. Averaged 0.7
 
The only way TB leaves is if it’s his own idea , despite the message board haters wanting him gone I couldn’t see JC asking him to leave . Despite his limitations would Pitt be a better team without him ? Would you rather have Coulibaly taking his minutes this season ? While we all have great hopes for the newcomers until they start playing college ball it’s hard to tell what they will bring to the table next yr . Most Fr bigs need seasoning . I doubt that JC wants to go into next season with zero experience inside .

If Pitt lands Jeffress that really changes things for Drumgoole , the mysterious thing is that he was good enough in early practice to gain a spot in the starting lineup . He must have showed something , but since his injury he just looks lost and overmatched . Players don’t stay where they’re not in rotation , gone are the days where players work hard and improve so they can play in their 3rd , 4th or 5th yr . My guess is that if anyone leaves it him .

I do agree with mostly everything you said but as far as TB coach didn't bring him in so he's not one of his guys so if one of the bigs that Vader talked about wants to come especially one of the ones JC really wants I don't see him having any qualms about telling TB to move on and it would be in TB's best interest to take classes this summer and graduate early that way he can go as a grad trans anywhere. IMO
 
I do agree with mostly everything you said but as far as TB coach didn't bring him in so he's not one of his guys so if one of the bigs that Vader talked about wants to come especially one of the ones JC really wants I don't see him having any qualms about telling TB to move on and it would be in TB's best interest to take classes this summer and graduate early that way he can go as a grad trans anywhere. IMO

Brown should only be asked to move on if we can bring on some Bigs who are clearly better from Day 1
 
Seniors:
Kene
Hamilton

1 open scholarship

2020 Class:

Max
Hughley
Collier

Basically the class is full from a numbers standpoint for next year. However, there's a path to one more. George moving on. That gives us 4 potential scholarships for 2020 class. I'm assuming that's already in the works. I'm sure Capel is helping George find a school he can move to as a grad transfer.

Other than that, I don't see where a 5th one could open up. No chance Terrell Brown moves on - by that I mean the coaches will want him to stay if they plan on winning in 2020-21. He's a huge difference maker defensively. He'll be the top shot blocker in Pitt history when he's done. You don't push that kid out the door.

Maybe AKC moves on? I don't want to say he was a desperate take by Capel last year, but I kind of think he was. I'm sure he'll be serviceable as an upper class man, but the two kids coming in next year may very well pass him up.

We'll see what happens - I'd be utterly shocked if Brown moves on. It wouldn't make any sense.

Samson George is not coming back either that's almost a given IMO so that's one more
 
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Anyone hoping that Terrell Brown leaves so that we can play two 350+ ranked developmental bigs and a barely top 100 big at Center for 35 games next year just doesn't understand basketball on a fundamental level.

but we need to rebuild! we need to play the young guys and winning doesn't matter!!!!

to those saying the above, please see Pitt's big men during the JD era. He played the older guys and won because they were better. The younger guys got better because they learned from the upper classman. Battled every day in practice.

Running these young guys out there fro 25+ min with no upper classman doesn't make them better. It can, but I'd rather have TB eat up a good portion of those min and prepare the younger guys when nobody is watching.
 
No chance. Not even remotely the same. Was wondering what happened to him. He disappeared again not long after being reinstated the last time. You 2 weren’t fighting again were you?
No haven't seen him on here for like 3 years now. That's what made me think Vader was him
What happened to mvk112? Piranha?
 
No haven't seen him on here for like 3 years now. That's what made me think Vader was him
What happened to mvk112? Piranha?

I believe mvk is around under another name. Some troll was harassing him and posting personal details I believe. I think I know who he is now but I’m not sure.

I wondered about Piranha too.

Geno2U is another one. I believe he was an older gentleman but not sure.

I don’t know anyone on these boards personally. I didn’t even know Paulb passed. Don’t think it was mentioned on the FB or BB board. If it was I somehow missed it.
 
I believe mvk is around under another name. Some troll was harassing him and posting personal details I believe. I think I know who he is now but I’m not sure.

I wondered about Piranha too.

Geno2U is another one. I believe he was an older gentleman but not sure.

I don’t know anyone on these boards personally. I didn’t even know Paulb passed. Don’t think it was mentioned on the FB or BB board. If it was I somehow missed it.
Yeah someone mentioned Paul. I don't remember who. Haven't seen CaptainSidneyReilly forever either.
 
Yeah someone mentioned Paul. I don't remember who. Haven't seen CaptainSidneyReilly forever either.

Captain mentioned he’d be stepping away a while back. I believe someone posted they thought he was having health issues. I think he was on the older side as well.

I found the thread about Paul after your post. FKThomas was who brought it up - on the locker room I believe. Which would explain why I never saw it.
 
Captain mentioned he’d be stepping away a while back. I believe someone posted they thought he was having health issues. I think he was on the older side as well.

I found the thread about Paul after your post. FKThomas was who brought it up - on the locker room I believe. Which would explain why I never saw it.
Right he did but it was also brought up in the Harve thread I believe too.
 
Seniors:
Kene
Hamilton

1 open scholarship

2020 Class:

Max
Hughley
Collier

Basically the class is full from a numbers standpoint for next year. However, there's a path to one more. George moving on. That gives us 4 potential scholarships for 2020 class. I'm assuming that's already in the works. I'm sure Capel is helping George find a school he can move to as a grad transfer.

Other than that, I don't see where a 5th one could open up. No chance Terrell Brown moves on - by that I mean the coaches will want him to stay if they plan on winning in 2020-21. He's a huge difference maker defensively. He'll be the top shot blocker in Pitt history when he's done. You don't push that kid out the door.

Maybe AKC moves on? I don't want to say he was a desperate take by Capel last year, but I kind of think he was. I'm sure he'll be serviceable as an upper class man, but the two kids coming in next year may very well pass him up.

We'll see what happens - I'd be utterly shocked if Brown moves on. It wouldn't make any sense.
God forbid a freshman isn't an immediate star. You guys are too much.
 
God forbid a freshman isn't an immediate star. You guys are too much.
This wasn't just meant for you. Too much chatter about moving Drumgoole Coulibaly and even Brown out to make room. Brown isn't going anywhere and the two freshmen just need time.

I doubt Capel will push either freshman out so I guess all the talk is moot anyway.
 
I don't want Brown gone, but who goes if Jeffress wants to come to Pitt and reclass into 2020? Who goes if Sanoga wants to reclass into 2020 and come to Pitt? At the end of the day Pitt will still be a bubble team next year for the NCAA with or without Brown and the upside of these other players is hard to ignore especially when the long-term viability of the program is more critical.
Tough decisions are ahead if they can actually sign Jeffress and Sanogo . If Sanogo comes to Pitt along with Hugley and Max I think Coulibaly would be the logical choice to go . How much PT would he get , his best interests would lie somewhere else .

Consider TB playing against high school players , like it or not he’d dominate. He needs to be here next yr , but does Coulibaly and the same could be said for Drumgoole . Players aren’t stupid , they want to play and if they’re recruited over why would you stay where all your gonna get is splinters and be a cheerleader !
 
Tough decisions are ahead if they can actually sign Jeffress and Sanogo . If Sanogo comes to Pitt along with Hugley and Max I think Coulibaly would be the logical choice to go . How much PT would he get , his best interests would lie somewhere else .

Consider TB playing against high school players , like it or not he’d dominate. He needs to be here next yr , but does Coulibaly and the same could be said for Drumgoole . Players aren’t stupid , they want to play and if they’re recruited over why would you stay where all your gonna get is splinters and be a cheerleader !
Sorry bro if we Sanogo its likely because of Karim being good friends with so TB IMO would have to go. Another thing TB hasn't ever dominated anybody seriously he's probably had 2 maybe 3 really good games since he's been here in three years. When your best skill is that you may block a 1 shot and if the circumstances right you might hit one or two open shots to go along with one or two rebounds a game that means your butt for real.
 
Sorry bro if we Sanogo its likely because of Karim being good friends with so TB IMO would have to go. Another thing TB hasn't ever dominated anybody seriously he's probably had 2 maybe 3 really good games since he's been here in three years. When your best skill is that you may block a 1 shot and if the circumstances right you might hit one or two open shots to go along with one or two rebounds a game that means your butt for real.
He’d be a beast in high school and he’ll be on next years roster !
 
I don't see any of these guys going. I don't Capel pushing anyone out. And, I doubt Pitt gets a commit from Sanogo.

I actually think Capel likes Brown and has no issue with him being around as a SR playing 15 to 20 minutes a game.
 
Conceivably, any number of guys could go. I don't think it would be Brown. X still remains a possibility, despite not having the kind of season some expected of him. I can't rule out Murphy either. Horton is going to seriously eat into his minutes next year.
 
Sorry to burst all your bubbles but Brown isn't going anywhere next year and he'll play around 20 minutes a game as a senior. He's just too much of a defensive asset in the post and not playing him would be a huge disservice to this team. The development of his shooting is also an unexpected strength that this team desperately needs in the post. Hugley should play 15-20 minutes next year depending on how ready he'll be to play in the ACC, Amadsun probably won't play much as a freshman, and I have no idea how much Coulibaly will improve. Terrell should be a pretty serviceable center in the ACC next year like it or not.

As things stand now, almost assured that next year will be like last and this year - HCJC holding his nose and going with whoever he can stand the most that night in the post.

2019 - Brown & Kene
2020 - Brown and Hamilton
2021 - Brown and Hugs

Only thing being that Hugs will have the potential to be a guy who can be more of an affirmative presence to the team once he gets experience and maturity.
 
As things stand now, almost assured that next year will be like last and this year - HCJC holding his nose and going with whoever he can stand the most that night in the post.

2019 - Brown & Kene
2020 - Brown and Hamilton
2021 - Brown and Hugs

Only thing being that Hugs will have the potential to be a guy who can be more of an affirmative presence to the team once he gets experience and maturity.

Your expectation could certainly be correct. However, for the moment I prefer to at least be somewhat more optimistic about next year's bigman play.

I tend to believe that Amadasun may also see some time -- possibly more productively than we have seen from Coulibaly this year because he is the one incoming player who appears to have the ability to play above the rim--at least on the defensive end assuming his offensive skills require greater development.

Also, and it is probably just wishful thinking on my part; but, I like to hope that we may see two bigs on the floor together next season--at least for some reasonable amount of time when bad inside matchups dictate the need. However, that will depend on how ready (or not ready) Hugley and Amadasun are to contribute.

Playing two bigs together also may depend on whether Collier turns out to be surprisingly better than expected in much the same way Champagnie has this season. Again, my wishful thinking wants to picture Collier as a taller version of Champagnie who could be on the floor often while we play only two true guards of the four (XJ, McGowens, Murphy, Horton) with the other two are on the bench for rest or due to foul trouble.

I am not a fan of 3-guard offenses unless at least one of the three guards is 6-5 or taller due to it often resulting in bad defensive matchups as we saw vs Syracuse where Boeheim could shoot over our shorter guards and he and Hughes also posted up our shorter guards on a number of occasions on Cuse's way to that 30-10 lead.
 
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Your expectation could certainly be correct. However, for the moment I prefer to at least be somewhat more optimistic about next year's bigman play.

I tend to believe that Amadasun may also see some time -- possibly more productively than we have seen from Coulibaly this year because he is the one incoming player who appears to have the ability to play above the rim--at least on the defensive end assuming his offensive skills require greater development.

Also, and it is probably just wishful thinking on my part; but, I like to hope that we may see two bigs on the floor together next season--at least for some reasonable amount of time when bad inside matchups dictate the need. However, that will depend on how ready (or not ready) Hugley and Amadasun are to contribute.

Playing two bigs together also may depend on whether Collier turns out to be surprisingly better than expected in much the same way Champagnie has this season. Again, my wishful thinking wants to picture Collier as a taller version of Champagnie who could be on the floor often while we play only two true guards of the four (XJ, McGowens, Murphy, Horton) with the other two are on the bench for rest or due to foul trouble.

I am not a fan of 3-guard offenses unless at least one of the three guards is 6-5 or taller due to it often resulting in bad defensive matchups as we saw vs Syracuse where Boeheim could shoot over our shorter guards and he and Hughes also posted up our shorter guards on a number of occasions on Cuse's way to that 30-10 lead.

I have a good feeling about Max, and it probably is a good chance he will see some minutes as a third option, but still gotta believe he is going to be raw enough that come ACC play he might see a handful of minutes a game.

Even going back to his Oklahoma days, HCJC has preferred a one in four out style. 2008-9 his top 7 players were 6-10 blake griffen, 6-4 PG Warren and a group of 6-7, 6-6, 6-6. 6-5 & 6-3 wings.

That is what he has said he would prefer since he has gotten to Oakland - a PG, a big and wings.

Going into next year his most proven, experienced and talented players are going to be X, Trey, Toney, Champ and Murphy. Horton likely will be in the mix.

When the schedule tightens up in ACC play, gotta believe he will default to what he knows and believes, and it is hard to think he is going to sit Toney, Champ or even Horton or Murphy so he can have to "bigs" just to play two bigs.

We have to hope Hugs has the talent to be a guy who can really help from day one, but until such time as AKC, Max and Collier get the maturity and experience to hold up consistently and also significantly impact the game ... It just seems that until he is able to add more high end talented big men like he had at Duke, he will go with the one in four out approach.

Or, I can see that with time, a year or two, Max will be good enough and Hugs will want the opportunity to play as a forward, that perhaps you might see a line up with Max at C and Hugs at PF, but hard to see that happening any time before 2021-22.
 
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I have a good feeling about Max, and it probably is a good chance he will see some minutes as a third option, but still gotta believe he is going to be raw enough that come ACC play he might see a handful of minutes a game.

Even going back to his Oklahoma days, HCJC has preferred a one in four out style. 2008-9 his top 7 players were 6-10 blake griffen, 6-4 PG Warren and a group of 6-7, 6-6, 6-6. 6-5 & 6-3 wings.

That is what he has said he would prefer since he has gotten to Oakland - a PG, a big and wings.

Going into next year his most proven, experienced and talented players are going to be X, Trey, Toney, Champ and Murphy. Horton likely will be in the mix.

When the schedule tightens up in ACC play, gotta believe he will default to what he knows and believes, and it is hard to think he is going to sit Toney, Champ or even Horton or Murphy so he can have to "bigs" just to play two bigs.

We have to hope Hugs has the talent to be a guy who can really help from day one, but until such time as AKC, Max and Collier get the maturity and experience to hold up consistently and also significantly impact the game ... It just seems that until he is able to add more high end talented big men like he had at Duke, he will go with the one in four out approach.

Or, I can see that with time, a year or two, Max will be good enough and Hugs will want the opportunity to play as a forward, that perhaps you might see a line up with Max at C and Hugs at PF, but hard to see that happening any time before 2021-22.

Excellent post. Your various scenarios all made sense and I especially
appreciate that you explained them as possibilities, as opposed to fact
as many on here tend to do.
Hugs making a major difference is pure speculation at this point.
Personally I think he will see playing time along with Amadasun, not
because I'm sure of how they'll turn out, but because we don't have
any other options besides Brown. Those two plus Brown IMO will be
an upgrade over Brown, Hamilton, and Coulibaly. If Coulibaly somehow
improves dramatically, that would be a big help.
I agree with the six players you said are our best. They are all guards
and wings. Collier getting playing time with that mix will be hard for him.
On the other hand, maybe he turns out like Champagnie did this year.
At this point it's hard to predict, but Capel clearly will have more options
next year, just as he had more this year.
I feel things are on the rise.
 
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Excellent post. Your various scenarios all made sense and I especially
appreciate that you explained them as possibilities, as opposed to fact
as many on here tend to do.
Hugs making a major difference is pure speculation at this point.
Personally I think he will see playing time along with Amadasun, not
because I'm sure of how they'll turn out, but because we don't have
any other options besides Brown. Those two plus Brown IMO will be
an upgrade over Brown, Hamilton, and Coulibaly. If Coulibaly somehow
improves dramatically, that would be a big help.
I agree with the six players you said are our best. They are all guards
and wings. Collier getting playing time with that mix will be hard for him.
On the other hand, maybe he turns out like Champagnie did this year.
At this point it's hard to predict, but Capel clearly will have more options
next year, just as he had more this year.
I feel things are on the rise.

I think Collier’s game and size are perfect for beating the zone like Champagnie was against Cuse.
 
We've beaten the Terrell Brown discussion to death.
As things stand now, almost assured that next year will be like last and this year - HCJC holding his nose and going with whoever he can stand the most that night in the post.

2019 - Brown & Kene
2020 - Brown and Hamilton
2021 - Brown and Hugs

Only thing being that Hugs will have the potential to be a guy who can be more of an affirmative presence to the team once he gets experience and maturity.
its Big John, Not Hugs
 
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I have a good feeling about Max, and it probably is a good chance he will see some minutes as a third option, but still gotta believe he is going to be raw enough that come ACC play he might see a handful of minutes a game.

Even going back to his Oklahoma days, HCJC has preferred a one in four out style. 2008-9 his top 7 players were 6-10 blake griffen, 6-4 PG Warren and a group of 6-7, 6-6, 6-6. 6-5 & 6-3 wings.

That is what he has said he would prefer since he has gotten to Oakland - a PG, a big and wings.

Going into next year his most proven, experienced and talented players are going to be X, Trey, Toney, Champ and Murphy. Horton likely will be in the mix.

When the schedule tightens up in ACC play, gotta believe he will default to what he knows and believes, and it is hard to think he is going to sit Toney, Champ or even Horton or Murphy so he can have to "bigs" just to play two bigs.

We have to hope Hugs has the talent to be a guy who can really help from day one, but until such time as AKC, Max and Collier get the maturity and experience to hold up consistently and also significantly impact the game ... It just seems that until he is able to add more high end talented big men like he had at Duke, he will go with the one in four out approach.

Or, I can see that with time, a year or two, Max will be good enough and Hugs will want the opportunity to play as a forward, that perhaps you might see a line up with Max at C and Hugs at PF, but hard to see that happening any time before 2021-22.
Regarding using 4 wing players. Not a problem if at least 2 have good size. Not so good if 3 or more are relatively short and some are not very good at shooting the 3-ball.

When I claim I dont like playing 3 guards I really mean I would like one of the three to have typical wing forward size (6-5 to 6-8) vs typical guard size (6-4 or under). Ideally you would not need to have more than 2 of the latter size players on the floor together except perhaps to help hold a late lead against full court pressure.
 
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