Steelers offense and Fields

[HailToPitt725]

Not comparing them -
But was the offense ever ultra conservative with Big Ben ?!?

It’s a silly narrative - the offense has been conservative because the qb okay has required it .

That’s fair. However, what’s stopping me from agreeing with you is the fact that Tomlin had a chance to hire an offensive coordinator that would bring a fresh perspective (like Kingsbury, who wanted to interview). Instead, he doubled down and hired someone who specifically had success playing a power-run, conservative style offense in Tennessee and Atlanta.

Also, it’s not like Wilson couldn’t throw the deep ball anymore. He was still top ten in air yards per completion, essentially a deep ball passing %, yet was in the bottom half of the league in terms of air yards per attempt, or how far you throw the ball on average.

 

[PittPharm2002]

That’s fair. However, what’s stopping me from agreeing with you is the fact that Tomlin had a chance to hire an offensive coordinator that would bring a fresh perspective (like Kingsbury, who wanted to interview). Instead, he doubled down and hired someone who specifically had success playing a power-run, conservative style offense in Tennessee and Atlanta.

Also, it’s not like Wilson couldn’t throw the deep ball anymore. He was still top ten in air yards per completion, essentially a deep ball passing %, yet was in the bottom half of the league in terms of air yards per attempt, or how far you throw the ball on average.

But he really wasn’t throwing deep balls - he was throwing “moon balls”-
Because he didn’t have the velocity .

Although it seems contrary to say Wilson was top 10 in deep balls while saying Tomlin made him conservative

 

[HailToPitt725]

But he really wasn’t throwing deep balls - he was throwing “moon balls”-
Because he didn’t have the velocity .

Although it seems contrary to say Wilson was top 10 in deep balls while saying Tomlin made him conservative

The way I see it, the numbers suggest Wilson can still take the deep shots, but Tomlin (and Smith) didn’t want him to because they’d rather stick to their preferred style of offense and limit turnovers as much as possible.

 

[lilspainishflea]

It begs the question- how would a guy like Winston fare in an ultra-conservative offense that is built around limiting turnovers? Could you take away his biggest weakness while retaining some of his big play ability?

I don’t know, but part of me wants to take the unknown over the same song-and-dance we’ve seen the past four seasons.

He did this pretty well for a few games in New Orleans before he broke his back. 170 yards, 2 TDs, and .4 INTs per game.

Jameis Winston 2021 Game Log | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Get Jameis Winston 2021 game log for regular season and playoff games on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

It’s why I want him

Want some shake up in a positive way .
He’s the guy . He balls out and seems like his teammates like him .

You may want him but I can’t imagine Tomlin does. It’s oil and water. The most risk avoidant coach with a guy who just slings it all over the lot. Not likely.

 

[steelcurtain55.]

The ultimate clown (Winston) joining the biggest clown show in the NFL would be perfect.

 

[CJsE]

That’s fair. However, what’s stopping me from agreeing with you is the fact that Tomlin had a chance to hire an offensive coordinator that would bring a fresh perspective (like Kingsbury, who wanted to interview). Instead, he doubled down and hired someone who specifically had success playing a power-run, conservative style offense in Tennessee and Atlanta.

Also, it’s not like Wilson couldn’t throw the deep ball anymore. He was still top ten in air yards per completion, essentially a deep ball passing %, yet was in the bottom half of the league in terms of air yards per attempt, or how far you throw the ball on average.

Kingsbury isn’t a long-term answer, he would have lasted 1, maximum 2 seasons before he jumped to another HC job. Then just like with the QB situation, they’d be hunting again this season for an OC unless one of the Steeler's QBs performed like Jayden Daniels and could be leveraged for another season to get even better HC opportunities for Kliff.

Which seems unlikely given how ridiculous Daniels' rookie season went.


The Steelers hired an OC for stability and to play to their roster's current strength.

 

[CJsE]

To add to the discussion. The Steelers weren't even all that bad under Fields. Keep in mind that 2 starting linemen were out for basically the entire season. A healthy offensive line and another year in the system should make him better. Should...



Edit: For comparison, here's where our QB play was at through 6 weeks last season.

 

[PittPharm2002]

You may want him but I can’t imagine Tomlin does. It’s oil and water. The most risk avoidant coach with a guy who just slings it all over the lot. Not likely.

Tomlin didn’t seem risk adverse with Ben slinging it

 

[King Of All Message Boards]

Tomlin didn’t seem risk adverse with Ben slinging it

Agreed. But Ben wasn’t a turnover machine. He took risks to be sure. But he didn’t turn it over like Jameis. Winston isn’t half the WB Ben was.

If Tomlin ever lands a stud QB I’d agree he might open things up a little.

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

Agreed. But Ben wasn’t a turnover machine. He took risks to be sure. But he didn’t turn it over like Jameis. Winston isn’t half the WB Ben was.

If Tomlin ever lands a stud QB I’d agree he might open things up a little.

so IF tomlin finds himself a Hall of Fame QB, he "Might" open things up a bit. lol. that's fantastic to hear.

 

[pittdan77]

I think it's very easy to get a read on how any QB search is going to go knowing the following:

1. The Steelers have made it clear they want to be a running team.
2. The QB will be asked to be a game manager who doesn't make mistakes.
3. There aren't any offensive weapons on the roster.
4. Team payroll is lopsided towards the defense.
5. The offensive line, despite all of the bluster, still stinks and that likely won't change.
6. There are rumblings that the locker room is a mess.

So, which QB's are going to beat the door down to take over this offense and how many years will they lock into with Justin Fields?

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

even avg qbs like Stafford or Carr are going to demand a 1st round pick and more from a team in a trade, that's how bad the QB market is now. Just a "sellers market."

so even if we want a 1 year stop gap / band aid like one of those two, we are going to have to give at least a 1st round pick and likely more. i mean is it worth it? I actually kind of like Stafford but dude is 37.

That's why i think you just go for Fields for 2 years and try and find your next qb in the draft. i know, more of a hope than a strategy but there just isnt squat out there..

 

[pittdan77]

That's why i think you just go for Fields for 2 years and try and find your next qb in the draft. i know, more of a hope than a strategy but there just isnt squat out there..

With what all you said, do you think they can get Fields for just two years? If I'm him, I'm coming in hot and demanding more. He has a ton of leverage.

 

[Usuallyunusual-partdeux]

Forget about the stillers situation for a moment and answer this question..

Would you redesign a whole offense around the worst starting QB in the NFL?

Ouch!!!

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

With what all you said, do you think they can get Fields for just two years? If I'm him, I'm coming in hot and demanding more. He has a ton of leverage.

good question, and no idea. what's funny is that most of the steelers fan base are deciding on if we should settle for fields or not and it will turn out that we wont be able to get him even if we did want him..


just a brutal QB situation we found ourselves in..

 

[pittdan77]

good question, and no idea. what's funny is that most of the steelers fan base are deciding on if we should settle for fields or not and it will turn out that we wont be able to get him even if we did want him..


just a brutal QB situation we found ourselves in..

It was probably financially smart to not pick up his option but it was always a risk. They really thought Wilson was going to carry them deep into the playoffs and it doesn't seem like much else mattered.

 

[joeydavid]

good question, and no idea. what's funny is that most of the steelers fan base are deciding on if we should settle for fields or not and it will turn out that we wont be able to get him even if we did want him..


just a brutal QB situation we found ourselves in..

...just a brutal QB situation that Omar Khan put them in... give credit to the guy who created the mess.

 

[joeydavid]

It was probably financially smart to not pick up his option but it was always a risk. They really thought Wilson was going to carry them deep into the playoffs and it doesn't seem like much else mattered.

What's the risk? Fields is projected to make $6 mil next year. His 5th year option was $25 mil.

 

[pittdan77]

What's the risk? Fields is projected to make $6 mil next year. His 5th year option was $25 mil.

The risk is that they can't sign him for $6 mil in a market where several teams will be looking for FA help and there might be a bidding war.

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

Guessing who the Steelers' quarterback is going to be is like watching a late 80's Survivor Series match with a mystery opponent. Trying to guess is fun and all, but you can kind of see that anyone who would move the needle even the slightest bit is already taken.

Team A: Hulk Hogan, The Ultimate Warrior, Macho Man, and the mystery man...

... drumroll, please...

Bushwhacker Luke!

 

[joeydavid]

The risk is that they can't sign him for $6 mil in a market where several teams will be looking for FA help and there might be a bidding war.

All but one of the teams in the NFL passed on Justin Fields just last year. Why would these same teams now think he's worth a "bidding war"?

 

[TheWerewolfFromTwilight]

...just a brutal QB situation that Omar Khan put them in... give credit to the guy who created the mess.

Could have done worse than Fields/Wilson for practically free. The mistakes began well before that.

- Let Ben stick around too long.

- Drafted a mid-round talent in the first round out of desperation.

If they really want to cash on this trifecta they'll draft Milroe or Dart. They need to take their lumps and then find a way to get into the top ten either in 2026 or 2027.

 

[PittPharm2002]

so IF tomlin finds himself a Hall of Fame QB, he "Might" open things up a bit. lol. that's fantastic to hear.

I’d say just a capable qb

 

[HailToPitt725]

Kingsbury isn’t a long-term answer, he would have lasted 1, maximum 2 seasons before he jumped to another HC job. Then just like with the QB situation, they’d be hunting again this season for an OC unless one of the Steeler's QBs performed like Jayden Daniels and could be leveraged for another season to get even better HC opportunities for Kliff.

Which seems unlikely given how ridiculous Daniels' rookie season went.


The Steelers hired an OC for stability and to play to their roster's current strength.

This is great analysis; thanks for this post + your other one. Personally, I would’ve been fine with the tradeoff of Kingsbury (or someone else) being here for 1-2yrs because A) it likely means the offense performed better than it did this season, and B) unless you count Fields, we don’t have a “QB of the future” whose development would’ve been stunted by an OC switch. When you’re in win-now mode, especially with the money we invested in the defense, I think they should’ve pulled the trigger.

With that being said, your last sentence is not wrong and I accept the reasons why they hired Smith. I don’t think he was a bad hire, but he seemed like the “safe” pick to me, which is what we’ve been doing for far too long.

 

[boseman7]

So it worked so well by making Kevin Dotson play out of position to his weak side that Tomlin said let’s do it again and hope for different results!!! The problem isn’t Jones or the line , it’s the coaching staff being incompetent. They drafted a ALL PRO caliber Guard in the later rounds and messed it up because of their own stupidity. Khan has drafted ok but trusting Tomlin to develop these guys is suspect.

 

[OH Pete]

It seems to me that if they are going to keep Fields, then they should design a modern offense around his skills, like Philly and Baltimore have successfully done. The Steelers offense seems to rely too much on the power/heavy type formations. I could be wrong, but those other offenses just seem more dynamic.

I'm not convinced that the power heavy formations are the issue. I'm thinking the issue is that they don't utilize the RPO and read option. Every play is preset as to what they are going to do. As the season progresses, teams catch on. It is too robotic. The scheme just doesn't allow for Fields to do what Fields can do - make plays. Tomlin and Smith are control freaks that want their players to do exactly what they tell them to do. They won't even allow audibles, which boggles my mind. I'm not in favor of just letting the players do whatever the hell they want because that would result in what we see from Capel in basketball. But I would like audibles and improv to be an important part of each game to keep the defense guessing.

 

[pittdan77]

All but one of the teams in the NFL passed on Justin Fields just last year. Why would these same teams now think he's worth a "bidding war"?

It was a trade. Not sure what you mean. But there are already articles about the Giants going after him and Adam Schefter is reporting that "a number of teams" are interested.

 

[BreakingPitt]

Looks like the Steelers are exploring all options at QB.

Report: Steelers Calling Jaguars for Trevor Lawrence

The Pittsburgh Steelers are asking about a possible trade for former first-overall pick Trevor Lawrence. According to Ryan Burr of the Big Ten Network, the team has inquired about a trade for the QB, and the source comes straight from the Jaguars.

www.yardbarker.com

 

[HailtoPitt]

I'm not convinced that the power heavy formations are the issue. I'm thinking the issue is that they don't utilize the RPO and read option. Every play is preset as to what they are going to do. As the season progresses, teams catch on. It is too robotic. The scheme just doesn't allow for Fields to do what Fields can do - make plays. Tomlin and Smith are control freaks that want their players to do exactly what they tell them to do. They won't even allow audibles, which boggles my mind. I'm not in favor of just letting the players do whatever the hell they want because that would result in what we see from Capel in basketball. But I would like audibles and improv to be an important part of each game to keep the defense guessing.

Reminds my of Wanny and Cavanaugh. Matt didn't even want his QBs to take a "free play" throw when the defense was offsides because the QB could be wrong.

 

[pittdan77]

Looks like the Steelers are exploring all options at QB.

Report: Steelers Calling Jaguars for Trevor Lawrence

The Pittsburgh Steelers are asking about a possible trade for former first-overall pick Trevor Lawrence. According to Ryan Burr of the Big Ten Network, the team has inquired about a trade for the QB, and the source comes straight from the Jaguars.

www.yardbarker.com

That....I don't know why Jacksonville would do that.

Oh yeah, they won't.
https://nfltraderumors.co/jaguars-call-idea-of-trading-trevor-lawrence-ridiculous/

 

[steelcurtain55.]

When Lawrence was coming out, I liked him so much, I wanted the Steelers to tank their season to get the #1 pick.

 

[Pitt79]

View embedded media

This is why they won't win sh!t BECAUSE...

OFFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!

NOT DEFENSE

 

[PittPharm2002]

That....I don't know why Jacksonville would do that.

Oh yeah, they won't.
https://nfltraderumors.co/jaguars-call-idea-of-trading-trevor-lawrence-ridiculous/

They wouldn’t
It’s blog nonsense

 

[PittPharm2002]

This is why they won't win sh!t BECAUSE...

OFFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS!!!

NOT DEFENSE

The number 1 defense has won , what 8/10 of the last Super Bowl s

 

[Zeldas Open Roof]

unfortunately for Tomlin, having the most expensive defense and having the best defense are two very different things.

tomlin wants to win with dominating defenses and a ball controlled offense that relies on the run. ok, fine, unfortunately his defensive system is tired and predictable and ineffective and we cant run the ball.

 

[boseman7]

The Steelers process is backwards…..I say it all the time, SCHEME,BLOCKING,SKILL,

It never fails when you do it backwards or mess up the order you mess up and draft wrong or misevaluate. I actually think there was nothing really wrong with Kenny Pickett. He just got drafted to a team that didn’t have a scheme. I feel like any QB would have that issue here and that starts with Ownership and the GM then the Coach …..they still haven’t learned…..they still got Pat Meyers here smh

 

[joeydavid]

Justin Fields is willing to come back to the stillers, if they guarantee that he will be the starter. LOL at Omar.

The smart play is to stop taking this bum's agent's call.

 

[Fk_Pitt]

I’d say just a capable qb

Not sure what gives you that confidence. But ok.

 

[boseman7]

Not to troll but I really want some thoughts on this…….What QB could come here and have success with Mike Tomlin having his fingerprints in the offense?? Like if they got a Matt Stafford would he be “ Matt Stafford “ here or would he turn into the scared first year version of Stafford in Detroit because they are paranoid about turnovers????? I’m starting to legit believe this franchise would ruin any QB ……